Understanding Giles

[KaitKat]

The purpose of this isn’t to bash as I love most characters in the Buffyverse, I wanted to discuss either the worst or the most controversial moments of a character and explain them, you can defend them if you want but that’s not necessary if you don’t feel it’s defendable just explain where you think they are coming from. I’ve gotten some wonderful perspective from some of these threads and have learned to see characters I previously didn’t like in a better light so maybe this can be a positive thing. I figured I’d start with Giles since I just made a post about him.

1)He encourages Buffy to keep her identity a secret from Joyce in Season 2.

2)In Season 2 he also keeps secrets regarding his own past then became angry with Jenny for doing the same.

3)In Season 3 Giles drugs Buffy.

4)In Season 3 Giles was a terrible watcher, in my opinion to Faith to the point where teenagers were basically doing his job for him with the two best examples being Faith Hope and Trick and Consequences.

5)In Beauty and the Beast we see Giles snap at Xander for falling asleep while watching Oz them show Buffy fatherly affection when she does the same.

6)Giles appears to undermine Wesley.

7)In Season 4 there has been some criticism that Giles was blind to the path Willow was taking with her magic addiction.

8)In the Gift Giles is prepared to sacrifice Dawn. When Buffy fails to kill Ben, who is largely perceived as innocent, he gives a speech about Buffy not being able to do it because she’s a hero then proceeds to kill Ben.

9)In Season 6 Giles leaves the country after Willow brought Buffy back from the dead.

10)In Season 7 Giles conspires with Robin to kill Spike.

11)Giles did not help Angel save Fred in Season 5 of Angel. There is also a widely held belief that in Damages Andrew was acting on his orders not Buffy’s.

12)Giles asked Faith to kill Genevieve in the comics and arguably lied/manipulated her to do so while withholding information from Buffy.

13)Giles left all his material possessions to Faith despite viewing Buffy as a daughter.



I’d love to hear everyone’s opinions on these events. Feel free to list those that I missed and also feel free to list the moments where he shines as well. Also if someone wants to add from the comics since I haven’t read a lot of them that would be welcome.

 

[WillowsFaith]

The worst Giles moments were in season 6 & 7. He feels like a complete different character. Completely ignorant to Buffy and her struggles. In the early seasons he is justified for most of his actions. He is an adult figure that has to juggle the responsibilities of teaching Buffy and keeping her safe from exposing her Slayer identity. He just does his job🤷‍♀️and shows remorse for what he puts Buffy through. Xander and Willow are not technically his responsibility. I mean yeah he should be the adult and treat them all equally, especially after the years of camaraderie. But his only actually job is to train and protect Buffy. Once Giles stops being a watcher he becomes a better character and shows his true colors. Season 4 he is enjoying being a bachelor like man without responsibilities. but is still there for Buffy and the scoobies throughout the rest of their journey. Until season 6 where is like a unaware dad and feels dumbed down for plot purposes. S7 is just weird. He arguably was there more for Willow then Buffy. And his random disapproval of Buffy not needing him anymore was handle horribly.

 

[DeepBlueJoy]

My explanation for his various arcs of 'out of character-ness' is that he's a creature of the council. From day one, to the end. Yes, he really does care deeply about Buffy and the others, but when the rubber hits the road, it's 'the mission that matters' and that ALWAYS comes first, and usually (though I don't think the others realize it) second, third, and fourth as well. PEOPLE are that thing you save. Slayers are a tool, and the slayer's friends are by extension part of that toolkit.

Add to that, years of hurt and alienation and aloneness, and you have someone who has a well developed 'closedness' from human feelings and needs, including a blinder to his own. He is shut down. He is not unfeeling, but he is not in touch with his inner Rupert or his ability to EMPATHIZE. The ONE time he opens up himself during the series, he loses Jenny. He apparently tried and failed with Olivia at some point in the past, and it's clear right off that she cannot handle his life, so he has no reason to reopen himself.

It is also clear that he was close to Ethan, maybe even relationship close (it's stated by Joss they were sexual and suggested by the text -- that they had big orgies with his friends, ALL but one of whom was male). So, losing those friends and running back to the council in disgrace, could not set him up to be open to anyone about who he really was. At the time he met Buffy and company, he was an authority figure, and it was NOT appropriate for him to discuss his sexual/relationship past with CHILDREN.

So... I think taken as a whole, he is in character... he's a mixture of things... deeply compassionate, probably partly b/c of his time as a rebel, he does have some insight into real life - as against someone like Travers or Wesley, who are simply indoctrinated... The Council indoctrinates both slayer and watcher. the fact that he is SOMEWHAT different is a miracle. That he drugged Buffy for the council is proof he is a council man. That he later abandoned her in her hour of greatest need and left her to raise Dawn, alone, with PTSD and quite BROKE *not to mention with an out of control witch*, all after saving the world and digging out of her grave? That's a sign that he's reverted. And probably that he's close to a nervous breakdown, b/c he did lose his slayer, same as everyone else... except she was HIS responsibility. And even after she's back, I think he's still shattered.

(I DO think the writers handled a bad situation (ASH needing to cut his episodes back) very badly). But, given his actions with the drugging of Buffy, his lies about Ethan and Eyghon, his lying for Xander about the hyena, instead of making BUFFY his priority and worrying about whether she is traumatized - we see a pattern of attitudes emerge. In light of all that, his later behavior is horribly disappointing, but not truly surprising.

I do think he's utterly unreal when he arrives at her door with the scared-girl platoon of doom and dumps them on Buffy, who is still barely financially and emotionally together... That is just stupid writing. And he undercuts her over and over and over again, and publicly too.

He is lucky Buffy is not like him. If Buffy had been like Giles, she would have taken her sister and just left Giles and co and Sunnydale... but Buffy is better than that.

But again, that's what they gave us. Still and all, it does have a degree of internal consistency.

 

[thrasherpix]

1)He encourages Buffy to keep her identity a secret from Joyce in Season 2.

Mixed feelings. It makes sense that a Slayer should keep her identity a secret, but it was pretty much revealed (including where she lived) in season 1. She even got visits from her enemies. If I demanded realism (rather than how it was still self-aware, not taking itself too seriously, yet, and thus willing to go with it), I'd want an explanation (magical or otherwise) on why they didn't just burn her house down, kill her mother, or any other things that could've been done to force Buffy to leave Sunnydale, all without need for being expelled by Snyder.

Had her identity remained a secret, I'd support it. Once that wasn't the case then it gets a lot more grey. I'd like to think the Watchers would provide some of those agents they have on call to provide some protection for Joyce, but given that they won't even pay a Slayer a living wage as an adult (unlike the Watcher) despite all that she does, often at their orders, that seems unlikely.

It gets downright unforgiveable to me (and stupid on Giles part) when Angelus returns who is known to go after loved ones, and Giles to say to "ignore him" when Angelus leaves drawings. If I saw the show as more realistic then that would break my suspension of disbelief (and if I wrote it, it would be American Horror Story worthy that would never be allowed on Prime Time).

Once Joyce knew, then he should've at least helped Joyce deal with this, including in the lore and safety measures (her pocketing a cross just before letting Spike in would've been nice to see, not that this was guaranteed protection, but shows she wasn't completely ridiculous). That would also protect Buffy.

And as for Joyce blaming Giles...while I think this was Joyce's usual tactic to deflect and not blame herself, she did have a valid point.

2)In Season 2 he also keeps secrets regarding his own past then became angry with Jenny for doing the same.

I can see him keeping his own misspent youth a secret. And there is also the bizarre belief that what you don't know about can't hurt you that is prevalent in society, and perhaps that affected his thinking as well (especially once he started drinking). He seemed to think Buffy was safer for not knowing, which is absurd, but many people in real life hold similar beliefs.

But it was definitely a double-standard when it came to Jenny...though I could say that another possible factor is that he had felt enough guilt for his own secrets that he projected his self-loathing for that into Jenny. Not that it justifies it, and I'm glad they get over it, even if it's for Joss's sadistic reasons.

3)In Season 3 Giles drugs Buffy.

This is so egregious, and I consider it one of the scariest eps in part for that reason. I think they do it well, and I agree in another post that Giles does redeem himself for it starting by the last half of the episode and for the rest of the season, though it gives him less of a leg to stand on over Buffy hiding the return of Angel.

I've thought about it over the years and it's complicated. I think myself as Buffy would've forgiven him (though his training her with crystals at the start of season 5 would've gotten some snarky remarks that doubled as warnings), but myself as Joyce would not (and not just because what happened to Joyce herself). This gives a lot more fuel to what Joyce was saying earlier on why she blamed Giles for what happened.

4)In Season 3 Giles was a terrible watcher, in my opinion to Faith to the point where teenagers were basically doing his job for him with the two best examples being Faith Hope and Trick and Consequences.

Faith in a motel raises a lot of uncomfortable questions, the likely answers not suitable for Prime Time. I like to think that Giles did make offers which Faith rebuffed, but I just don't think it even occurred to the writers.

(The same writers who thought Buffy could support herself legally without ID and Social Security Number at the very bare minimum, which if she did then the Watchers and police could find her, and I've been tempted in the past to write a fanfic about how she managed it.

Likewise, it's never explained, probably never considered by people who have maids and personal assistants, how Anya keeps her clothes clean, goes to school without any school records, etc, etc.)

5)In Beauty and the Beast we see Giles snap at Xander for falling asleep while watching Oz them show Buffy fatherly affection when she does the same.

No excuse here, probably just the white knight aspect of patriarchal attitudes.

6)Giles appears to undermine Wesley.

I'm on his side for this one.

7)In Season 4 there has been some criticism that Giles was blind to the path Willow was taking with her magic addiction.

I'd have to see season 6 as consistent with earlier seasons rather than heavily retconned to accept that, and I don't, so can't really say.

8)In the Gift Giles is prepared to sacrifice Dawn. When Buffy fails to kill Ben, who is largely perceived as innocent, he gives a speech about Buffy not being able to do it because she’s a hero then proceeds to kill Ben.

While I feel sorry for Ben, and just can't overlook that Ben saved Giles' life not too long ago, I accept his decision here.

9)In Season 6 Giles leaves the country after Willow brought Buffy back from the dead.

Either lazy or punitive writing (since the actor had to leave for awhile). They could've sent him away with very little change, and wouldn't make him seem like such a jerk.

I've written essays on this, but I'll try to be very brief on how I think it should've been done here: one, he has an emergency, and also wants to consult some very well guarded texts on Buffy's resurrection that will take some time. He expresses every confidence in them in all that they've done so far, and he's a phone call away. That is, he's not doing this to "make them grow up" (which they already have), but because he thinks they already have and can manage without him for awhile.

But as it goes on, they're ashamed and don't call him, and lie to him when he does call (show him calling in and being lied to about how everything is fine, when the social worker is present would be perfect), so he doesn't realize how everything has gone to hades.

And to really sweeten it, add a scene where Anya, reinstated vengeance demon, shows up to Giles to try to trick him into making a wish against Xander, which he quickly sees through with some concern, and shortly after (once preparing himself) he shows up, continuing as is from "I'd like to test that theory." (And that's when he's learned all that they hidden from him...might be a good gesture for him to mention that he understands about wanting to keep some things secret, but that way can endanger others as well as one's self as a Slayer once taught him.)

10)In Season 7 Giles conspires with Robin to kill Spike.

Had Buffy at least made an attempt to continue to bind Spike (as she once did with Angel after he returned, as she did for Oz) then I don't think Giles would've. And neither would I.

As it was, had I been there, I'd have agreed with Giles and been in on the conspiracy against Buffy and Spike since Buffy was being so absurdly reckless (keep in mind the characters don't know it's a TV show where the protagonist has titanium plot armor).

I could say a lot more on this as well, but I'll just say...it's season 7, don't try to make sense out of it.


I tried the comics, couldn't accept them as the same universe or get into them, so I have nothing to add there.

 

[Faded90]

I think @thrasherpix answered these better than I could but I’ll add my thoughts on a few

2)In Season 2 he also keeps secrets regarding his own past then became angry with Jenny for doing the same.

Jenny had lied about her entire identity and who she was though. Jenny’s ‘I was here to watch you’ in Buffy and Giles’ eyes makes all their interactions with her questionable as they don’t know if she was just getting close to Giles to keep a closer eye on Buffy and Angel



4)In Season 3 Giles was a terrible watcher, in my opinion to Faith to the point where teenagers were basically doing his job for him with the two best examples being Faith Hope and Trick and Consequences.

One of Giles’ worst moments absolutely, it can’t be denied he neglected her. Giles seems to struggle with emotional support with troubled slayers clearly! 2 slayers under his charge and both to his neglect become suicidal. Both pull themselves through it but not with his help. Him leaving teenagers and Angel to be the ones to try to help Faith in Consequence

5)In Beauty and the Beast we see Giles snap at Xander for falling asleep while watching Oz them show Buffy fatherly affection when she does the same.

Pure favouritism 😂

6)Giles appears to undermine Wesley.

Wes deserved that. He was a coward and tried to give them up on his very first episode and double crossed them with Faith at a pivotal time. I think they were far too kind not to tell him to do one after that


9)In Season 6 Giles leaves the country after Willow brought Buffy back from the dead.

Bad Giles! To be honest I thought it was messed up he was leaving them alone on the hellmouth in Bargaining when he acknowledges himself that the demon world believing Buffy is still alive is all that keeps the town from crumbling and chaos ensueing. He left a robot as being the only thing from keeping threats at bay

11)Giles did not help Angel save Fred in Season 5 of Angel. There is also a widely held belief that in Damages Andrew was acting on his orders not Buffy’s.

I don’t have a problem with Giles not saving Fred - she was working for W&H , it’s in character for Giles not to consider saving Fred to be any kind of priority. I do think it’s OOC that they write him as apparently ignoring the rebirth of an Old One though. I headcanon that it’s actually the team of slayers in Damages in charge of retrieving Dana and the rest is Andrew being Andrew - telling stories and overblowing his own importance. I can totally see it as Giles sending a task force of slayers and saying

I preface the next two by saying I’ll never see the comics as a genuine continuation and at most a mad AU where copies of our TV characters have lost their minds and do crazy stuff. I genuinely don’t judge any of our TV characters on their comic exploits

12)Giles asked Faith to kill Genevieve in the comics and arguably lied/manipulated her to do so while withholding information from Buffy.

Giles doing his ‘I need to make
The tough choices’ thing. I don’t remember this well though!



13)Giles left all his material possessions to Faith despite viewing Buffy as a daughter.

Bad writing and a lazy plot device to cause further Buffy/Faith strife (the comics showed they had no idea how to write their relationship and completely ignored how much they’d resolved in S7) . Done for a cheap shock factor, I find it completely believable he’d leave them both things but the idea he’d feel the need to leave everything to only one of them is ridiculous - Giles is far too logical for that. Infairness I think the writers knew it was ridiculous considering how quickly they forget about it, have Giles dash back to Buffy and then pretty much just forget that Giles and Faith were ever close. Then in the final issue Giles is calling Buffy his only daughter. The comics were terrible at consistent relationship writing though and often chose to just completely forget things they were bored of

 

[KaitKat]

I’ve really enjoyed reading other people’s thoughts here are mine:

1)The only reason I can think of that Giles actively encourages Buffy to keep the fact that she’s a Slayer from Joyce is the fact that for him it is so engrained in his training that he doesn’t even question it. He also may naively believe that if Joyce knows that Buffy is the Slayer it will put her in danger. This logic doesn’t track but I’d assume that it’s part of the Watcher’s curriculum that has likely been pushed down his throat since he was a child.

2)In Season 2 when he keeps the parts of his past hidden that he isn’t proud of I think boys simply shame. He has a very high opinion of Buffy, her friends, and Jenny and neither wants to tell them of the worst this he has ever done or have them clean up his mess. As for the rest of it I understand that Giles is hurt my Jenny’s perceived betrayal but I do think he is more harsh with her than necessary.

3)Giles drugging Buffy is by far the worst thing he has ever done and in my opinion it’s surprising that Buffy was on the receiving end of this since most of the awful things Giles does is because he is so tunnel visioned when it comes to Buffy that other characters tend to pay the price. This can’t be defended and I also think that it’s one of the worst “sweeping something disturbing under the rug moments” in the entire series. What makes this particularly awful is Giles is an adult in a position of authority and probably the adult that Buffy trust the most, including her mother and what he did is a complete violation. Helpless my arguably be the most important episode in Giles arc in the same way Who Are You is important to Faith’s. The question of where does Giles loyalty ultimately lie with Buffy or the counsel comes into play and the writers don’t let him take the easy way out, such as telling Buffy from the get go and planning to deceive the counsel together. Instead we watch Giles at first reluctantly comply, begin to stand up to Travers, then intervene to the point where he was ultimately fired for having a fathers love for Buffy. I really do hate that the events of this episode where never addressed in cannon again.

4)Faith is the character I think payed the heaviest price for the tunnel vision Giles suffers from when it comes to Buffy. For every single thing he did right by Buffy there is his glaring failure with Faith to contrast it. Faith makes an entrance in Faith Hope and Trick and at first everything appears to be five-by-five and there is no reason to believe that Faith needs anything from Giles or anyone else. Buffy quickly suspects that something may be wrong when Faith beats a vampire longer than necessary, very reminiscent of Ted where Buffy seemingly beat a human not too soon after, she shares her concerns with Giles who blows them off. Buffy is able to get through to Giles who attempts to contact Faith’s Watcher who turns out to be dead. He then sends Buffy to deal with it, in theory this may sound okay because Buffy is the Slayer and Kakistos did need killed and have a lot in common, both of their first watchers died and they both recently ran away. However Buffy is a teenager with PTSD not a therapist as evidenced by the way she handled the situation, I do think this is a failure on the writers part I pinpoint this episode as the exact one where they begin showing that Buffy has learned her lessons by talking down to others that are in a similar situation as her, even if Giles wasn’t invested in Faith I think he should have dealt with the situation so that Buffy didn’t have to and could continue to focus on putting her own life back together. At the end of the episode Giles tells Buffy that he will look after Faith until her new watcher arrives and then proceeds to not do that. I think that both Giles and Buffy believe with Kokistos dead Faith’s issues are put to rest and that simply isn’t true. I remember watching episodes like Band Candy where Giles and Joyce act like divorced parents micromanaging Buffy’s schedule and I wonder what would have happened if he would have put a fraction of that energy into Faith, Revelations is the only episode I can recall him training her in and that wasn’t one-on-one.

Before Consequences I find Giles treatment of Faith indifferent during this episode I find it appalling. I will start off by saying I hate this episode in general and I can only think of one maybe two characters out of six that weren’t painted in a bad light and no Faith isn’t one of them. It feels like the fact that Finch’s death was an accident was ignored for the majority of the episode Giles was actually the first one to bring reason to the situation when he told Buffy that these things are tragic but they happen and he wasn’t going to involve the counsel due to Faith’s mental state. I do say that even if he were planning on going along with Faith’s lie for Buffy’s benefit yelling at her was the worst thing he could have done and will further convince Faith that admitting what happened is not in her best interest and probably reinforced the idea that she is bad and she is a killer. Giles may not be Faith’s official Watcher at this point but both girls came to him, he’s an adult and he has blood on his hands as well he could have leveled with her and choose not to. The part that really irks me though is when he has a meeting with Buffy, Willow, and Xander to decide which one of them will deal with it. They are children he is the adult.

Furthermore so much of Faiths issues come from the fact that she is desperately seeking the approval of an authority figure. Giles was one of I’m sure many to reject her so she found that in the major. I do believe that Faith is responsible for her own actions but I would have liked to have seen Giles acknowledge his failures.

5)To me this is partially an example of Giles viewing Buffy through rose colored glasses compared to everyone else, I honestly found it cringy. My main defense for Giles in this episode is that he knows what Buffy has been through recently and is currently unaware that she is hiding Angel so it’s easy to sympathize with her. As an audience member I sympathize with Xander as well because I assume that he volunteered to watch Oz to get away from his own home for a night but I don’t recall Giles knowing how bad Xander’s home life is in the show and honestly the characters who are aware kind of treat it like a joke.

6)The Wesley we meet in Season 3 is arrogant and largely incompetent. The first time I watched Buffy when I was 10 I found the way that Giles and Buffy treated Wesley funny, now at 3 I find it extremely immature. I absolutely understand Giles decision to keep Wesley out of the loop in Consequences as Wesley’s locality was to the Counsel, he had only been in town for two days, and it was a delicate situation. With all of this said I think by the end of Consequences Wes showed more growth than any other character and earned the rights t to not be kept out of the loop. Giles again undermined him in Enemies which can be objectively called a bad plan despite the great cinematic moments. In Enemies Xander blames Wes for Faith’s actions telling him that she was his responsibility however how can be do his job when he is intentionally kept out of the loop. Wesley’s character was introduced to make Giles look better in contrast which is lazy writing. I’m also pretty upset that Giles didn’t contact Wes when Faith woke up, he obviously had no interest in reaching out to the girl he may as well have let someone else try.

7)I have heard some criticism that Giles basically gave Willow a loaded gun when it comes to magic and or used her as a weapon. I don’t think this is entirely fair, Giles activity discouraged Willow from becoming over involved in magic however I do think he was a little blind to not see that path she was headed down given his own magic addiction, I mostly explain this as him believing she was better than he was. Overall I think that Giles was at his worst during season 3 despite the overall agreement from fans that it was in Season 6/7. The biggest thing in Season 4 that disappoints me is the lack of reflection.

8)I do not blame Giles for suggesting that if it comes down to it that Dawn can’t be put above the fate of every single living being, he has to be the voice of reason because Buffy can’t be, Dawn is her sister. I don’t think that Buffy not killing Ben makes her a hero but Giles loves Buffy and therefore that is how he interprets it. I also think that Giles killing Ben was completely necessary and doing it himself rather than encouraging Buffy to be the Slayer and do it herself is an act of pure love.

9)I’m one of the few fans who doesn’t completely hate Giles for abandoning Buffy in Season 6. He may not have handled the situation correctly but I truly do believe that he thought he was doing the right thing as Buffy was relying more on him than herself. I will say that his comment about how Buffy will figure out how to manage a household because her mom did it without the benefit of superpowers was tone deaf but fits in character since he allowed Faith to live in a motel room in Season 3, presumably believing she will be fine because she is a Slayer? I also think at this point he knows how bad Willow’s magic addiction is and he did ignore it.

10)I don’t have a problem with Giles conspiring to kill Spike. I do like Spike’s character and do believe that Buffy is correct when she states that he can be a good man. However he also has a trigger that she is ignoring. Giles tried to detrigger him, tried to keep him chained up but Buffy won’t meet him halfway forcing him to take extreme action. I don’t agree with the general census that his behavior was a reaction to Buffy no longer needing him. I think he’s hurt that Buffy won’t take his advice but Buffy didn’t surpass him in wisdom as Spike suggest and Giles here puts the fate of the potentials above his relationship with Buffy.

11)I agree with Faded90 Giles saving Fred isn’t out of character per say, as viewers we may be angry at him because we are watching these episodes emotionally but Giles doesn’t even know Fred all he knows is that she works for Wolfram & Hart. I do think it’s really out of character though to not help Angel put Illyria back in the Deeper Wells. Giles historically will put the fate of the world above personal issues and he fails to do that here.

12)I think that Giles asking Faith to kill Genevieve and keeping it from Buffy shows that he still sees Buffy through rose colored glasses and he still has a fundamental lack of understanding of the events on Season 3. Faith psychologically snapped after killing Finch it took her years to rebuild her life I think it was simple of him to put her in that position especially since Buffy has already proven she is willing to kill a Slayer.

13)I don’t have a problem with Giles leaving his material passions to Faith as he truly believed that Buffy didn’t need them and Faith did, however why can he only show one of them affection at a time?

 

[thetopher]

Giles is one of my favourite characters, so I'll have a stab at answering these as best I can:

1)He encourages Buffy to keep her identity a secret from Joyce in Season 2.

This seems to be Watcher protocol; a slayer cannot reveal their identity to normies, even loved ones (which wouldn't really be an issue since the WC would usually simply remove a young slayer from said loved ones, often willingly). Xander and Willow get a pass because they discovered things organically- Buffy didn't tell them- and the circle slowly expanded from there.
I'm sure Giles, who is still a loyal employee of the council, is loath for Buffy's secret to become more widespread so he insists that Buffy can't and must find a way around it.

I'm not sure that's particularly wise given the threat that Angelus poses but Buffy doesn't disobey, and she's disobeyed him over smaller things in the past...so maybe she isn't sure what to do?
I agree its poor advice from Giles; a little blinkered and, well, Watcher-y. But at this stage he still very much is.

2)In Season 2 he also keeps secrets regarding his own past then became angry with Jenny for doing the same.

Somewhat irrational but I would say that Giles tried to protect everybody from his past mistake by not involving them, and didn't have a lot of time- 24 hours? - to process that all his old friends had died/been murdered by Eyghon.
Jenny Calendar kinda insinuated herself into Giles confidence almost- but not quite- under false pretenses over a much longer period of time. She knowingly hid an agenda that would effect Buffy- his charge- and so that was a professional slight as well as a personal one.

So its fair to say that her secret was bigger and the betrayal of trust greater. Plus there was obvious intent to deceive in Jenny's case.
Also he felt that he had to distance himself from Jenny for Buffy's sake as well. I think Giles was okay reacting the way he did.

3)In Season 3 Giles drugs Buffy.

Yeah, straight up betrayal that Giles knew was wrong and cruel but did anyway under direct pressure from a council elder; its a test for him as well. One of Giles worst moments and deepest betrayals. At least at the end he kills one of the vampires going after Buffy and Joyce.
Also mitigated by almost all his other behavior towards Buffy that season; he spent the summer looking for her, he welcomes her back without any harshness, just happy and relieved, he is actively supportive of her school endeavors such as Homecoming campaigning, SAT tests, Prom, etc. He gives her sound advice about a possible college future in 'Lover's Walk', is (eventually) understanding about the 'Angel situation' and even the eventual breakup, and is a pretty constant support post-firing when Buffy has to deal with Wesley.
Basically he believes in Buffy and thought that she would pass the Cruciamentum.

4)In Season 3 Giles was a terrible watcher, in my opinion to Faith to the point where teenagers were basically doing his job for him with the two best examples being Faith Hope and Trick and Consequences.

A darn neglectful Watcher for most of what was 'his responsibility shift' given Faith's living situation. We know she trained with Buffy and patrolled but not what support was given to her by anybody. And it gets worse after Post where nobody seems to know where Faith is half the time. So it seems like Giles couldn't be bothered to try and heal that rift caused by 'Revelations', Post and the rest.

Again, Giles is a watcher and probably fell back on protocol and precedent but he really dropped the ball in 'Consequences' where- again- he had precedent, as he tells Buffy, (but not Faith, who needs to hear it as well) but instead does absolutely nothing and so Wesley ends up doing the worst thing. All this is made even worse that Giles doesn't seem to think he did anything wrong until...maybe S8 when he and Faith make amends.
I'd put 'Consequences' alongside 'Helpless' as a massive Giles fail, its just not one the narrative focuses on.

5)In Beauty and the Beast we see Giles snap at Xander for falling asleep while watching Oz them show Buffy fatherly affection when she does the same.

Xander was supposed to be on duty and fell asleep immediately, Buffy obviously took over from Faith- which was nice- and fell asleep whilst reading books and doing research (trying to stay awake), which Giles appreciates.

But that's partly a rationalization, Giles likes Buffy but finds Xander somewhat of an irritant/superfluous, not to mention he was also angry with his obfuscations and attempts at humour-deflection. If Xander had been maybe angry with himself Giles wouldn't have been so hard on him.
Also also tensions were running high that particular morning whereas with Buffy Oz was still secure in his cage.

6)Giles appears to undermine Wesley.

Certainly early on; he's peeved that he's been fired and replaced and takes it out of the council's new representative. At least at first.
As things go on Giles balances supporting Buffy from Wesley's ways with helping investigate the upcoming Big Bad events. It's a process that goes from 'Bad Girls' to 'Enemies' and after that the two of them are generally on the same page until Graduation Day where again Giles supports Buffy against Wesley.
I wouldn't call this a negative given he's trying to make amends with Buffy, and it shows some growth that, now as a none-watcher, he agrees that Angel's life has value.

7)In Season 4 there has been some criticism that Giles was blind to the path Willow was taking with her magic addiction.

Criticism from people who don't hold Willow responsible for any of her actions, I presume? Yeah, I don't agree, Giles warned Willow in S2, blocked her attempts to look at the more advanced stuff in S3, which she circumvented to his face.
By S4 Willow is an adult well on the way to doing what she wants, she's not Giles responsibility in any official sense; she has parents, he's not her Watcher and she's just resentful of his concerns anyway. Not a failing of Giles really, just Willow continuing down her dark path.

8)In the Gift Giles is prepared to sacrifice Dawn. When Buffy fails to kill Ben, who is largely perceived as innocent, he gives a speech about Buffy not being able to do it because she’s a hero then proceeds to kill Ben.

Giles does not think sacrificing Dawn is a noble act, he's not the Knights of Byzantium, he views it as a possible, horrible but necessary act to save the entire world. It is his job, his training- his calling- to make those judgements. He is open and honest with Buffy about his pov, which is the right thing to do.

I don't think this is a problem because both Giles reasoning and actions are out there for everyone to see, especially Buffy. And he also sees and respects her pov, the view that might very well doom the world. without judgement.
In fact Giles respects Buffy for her stance as he tells her (earlier) when he's been stabbed in 'Spiral'.

9)In Season 6 Giles leaves the country after Willow brought Buffy back from the dead.

I believe that, unlike everyone else on team Scoobie, Giles mourned Buffy's death properly and was in the process of moving on when she was resurrected. Buffy even asks if her being alive was 'inconvenient' timing.
While that isn't strictly true I think Giles was simply unable to return to being a Watcher for Buffy- at that time- because in his estimation he had gotten her killed as any watcher eventually does- and as a father couldn't stand to see her suffer, so he left.

Giles had seen that Buffy was perfectly capable of being an adult and taking care of Dawn in S5 so he rationed that she could do that all again without him. He didn't grasp the depths of her depression or her unwise closeness with Spike, otherwise I don't think he would've left.
When Giles does return in 'Graves' he and Buffy finally have the conversation about her existential mindset to which Giles can only apologize for leaving. Buffy says he did the right thing so I guess that mitigates it somewhat.
It was weak but I don't think it was malicious. No character escapes S6 writing unscathed.

10)In Season 7 Giles conspires with Robin to kill Spike.

Spike is a tool of the First and spectacularly unbothered by that fact, probably because Buffy is so chill with it as well. Buffy and Spike have no answers regarding the trigger beyond 'Buffy being near Spike or Spike being chained up' to keep everyone safe. A set of affairs they frequently break when Buffy goes on dates or goes back to the dawn of time, leaving trigger!Spike unguarded.
Also Spike is seemingly allowed to go out drinking a lot, with Anya, and Buffy doesn't seem to care.

So Giles goes out and finds a magical cure, but, again, Spike doesn't really want to anything to do with it, even with a looming apocalypse and being a thrall of The First. Again, the world is at stake. Giles is going to do what is morally consistent with his world view. And Spike is not at all like Dawn, Dawn was actually innocent and had no blood on her hands, somebody who would willingly sacrifice herself. Spike, on the other hand, seemingly doesn't want to be inconvenienced with the chafing that comes with being chained up.

The only problem I see with Giles actions is 1) his subterfuge regarding Buffy. Idiot though she is throughout S7 he should still respect her enough to say 'deal with him, or I will' and give her a short timeline before acting. 24 hours or something. Maybe Buffy could be prevailed to look more into dealing with the trigger. Or look at all, for that matter.
2) Allying with Wood who has his own agenda of willingly doing the bidding of The First. Giles should've questioned how Wood came to know what he knew about Spike killing Nikki Woods, not doing so was an intellectual oversight.
So, the right actions gone about the wrong way, Giles is the only one of the 4 in 'LMPTM' that I can stand, all the others are stupider or nastier.

11)Giles did not help Angel save Fred in Season 5 of Angel. There is also a widely held belief that in Damages Andrew was acting on his orders not Buffy’s.

Giles had never met Fred, didn't trust W&H and, presumably, couldn't contact Willow. I don't think Giles is lying about that last part. It is not Giles who can help Fred but Willow and the Illyria issue is pretty time critical. Angel is rightfully frustrated and hangs up. In my view that's not enough here to definitively call Giles a dick, just speculation.

As for 'Damage' yeah, I'd say this is Giles scheming to get a slayer out of the hands of W&H, Angel or no Angel. As for Andrew's 'nobody trusts you' speech...that could be just him? He's pretty much a fantasist... but its more likely he was paraphrasing a general sentiment amongst some of the Scoobies and making it explicit, maybe more explicit than Giles wanted, but the impression wasn't corrected so, yeah, kind of a dick thing to do.

12)Giles asked Faith to kill Genevieve in the comics and arguably lied/manipulated her to do so while withholding information from Buffy.

My biggest problem with Giles in S8 is his secrecy about the overall Twilight thing. But here I think by not telling Buffy about the assassination attempt is smart; firstly its compartmentalizing whilst Buffy deals with bigger, more looming threats that are currently escalating, secondly he doesn't believe that Buffy can do 'what is necessary' and kill Genevieve, whereas he thinks if he incentivizes Faith then she will act as an assassin, as she's done previously.

As for not telling Faith the truth, that's fair, but also by that time Faith was also reneging on their deal by shutting Giles out and leaving him in the dark about what was going on, Faith didn't have any intention of returning to her murderous ways and wanted to find out more about Genevieve, persuade her away from her evil schemes- when she thought they were apocalyptic and warn her about her manipulative 'sponsor' Roden.

13)Giles left all his material possessions to Faith despite viewing Buffy as a daughter.

Buffy and Giles and clearly been on the outs for a while now, possibly because of the events of Ats S5. Giles was kidnapped by Twilight and Buffy didn't even notice because of her shiny new superpowers.
But overall I think Faith's assessment was right; Giles gave Buffy what she needed and did the same with Faith- somebody he felt he'd let down in the past and was making right with by giving her some resources.
When Giles made his will doubtless he believed that Buffy would still have her massive castle, slayer army and other resources but in contrast Faith would still have nothing, so he gave her what she needed.
Besides, Buffy caused an apocalypse, she doesn't get gifts from the guy she got killed.


Other things that I think Giles didn't handle the right way:
- Thinking that the haunting in S2 'I Only Have Eyes For You', he is grieving but its such obvious cope.
- Taking his grumpiness at Mrs Post out on Willow and Xander by generally being too bossy.
- Taking Spike in at face value in 'The Yoko Factor'...but drunk-Giles is too funny to begrudge this.
- Not telling Faith about the First targeting the slayer line during S7. It was mostly the responsibility of him and/or Buffy but he had more leeway when it came to travelling. It comes across as callous- fine, okay- but also incompetent, Faith is a slayer and a resource, she should be guarded.
- Not telling anybody about Twilight, apparently Giles 'knew' about the forgotten/forbidden history that the WC feared Twilight and he was trying to find a way to 'secretly' stop it. Also kind of idiotic and short-sighted. Giles being stupid is unforgivable. S8 writing was not stellar.

 

[NotASlayer]

Spike is a tool of the First and spectacularly unbothered by that fact, probably because Buffy is so chill with it as well. Buffy and Spike have no answers regarding the trigger beyond 'Buffy being near Spike or Spike being chained up' to keep everyone safe. A set of affairs they frequently break when Buffy goes on dates or goes back to the dawn of time, leaving trigger!Spike unguarded.
Also Spike is seemingly allowed to go out drinking a lot, with Anya, and Buffy doesn't seem to care.

So Giles goes out and finds a magical cure, but, again, Spike doesn't really want to anything to do with it, even with a looming apocalypse and being a thrall of The First. Again, the world is at stake. Giles is going to do what is morally consistent with his world view. And Spike is not at all like Dawn, Dawn was actually innocent and had no blood on her hands, somebody who would willingly sacrifice herself. Spike, on the other hand, seemingly doesn't want to be inconvenienced with the chafing that comes with being chained up.

The only problem I see with Giles actions is 1) his subterfuge regarding Buffy. Idiot though she is throughout S7 he should still respect her enough to say 'deal with him, or I will' and give her a short timeline before acting. 24 hours or something. Maybe Buffy could be prevailed to look more into dealing with the trigger. Or look at all, for that matter.
2) Allying with Wood who has his own agenda of willingly doing the bidding of The First. Giles should've questioned how Wood came to know what he knew about Spike killing Nikki Woods, not doing so was an intellectual oversight.
So, the right actions gone about the wrong way, Giles is the only one of the 4 in 'LMPTM' that I can stand, all the others are stupider or nastier.

I can understand why Giles went behind Buffy's back. Neither Buffy nor Spike had any interest in dealing with the trigger and were endangering everything as a result and Buffy's S7 decision making is so monumentally poor I can see her doing something dumb like running off with Spike to "protect" him if given an ultimatum. She simply could not be trusted, and I have no idea why anyone was listening to her at all by the end of the season (I guess we never saw Buffy laying out her "plan" on screen for the battle of the Hellmouth because doing so would have shown just how utterly stupid it was, lacking as it was any way of winning). Plus, Giles's actions did result in the trigger being deactivated. So, overall, he did the right thing that Buffy could not be trusted to do.

 

[thetopher]

I can understand why Giles went behind Buffy's back. Neither Buffy nor Spike had any interest in dealing with the trigger and were endangering everything as a result and Buffy's S7 decision making is so monumentally poor

I agree, in general, but Giles doesn't know what we know; he wasn't there for 'Get It Done' for example, to witness the onset of Buffy's brainrot, he didn't see a lot of her questionable training methods, or callousness, or hypocrisy, so I can't say that he understands how far gone she actually is.
Oh, he does, eventually, with the vile 'one person watching my back' comment in 'Empty Places' being the 'aha' moment, which is after LMPTM.

I still think he should've quizzed Wood much harder though, too trusting of a guy they barely knew he had been deceiving them for months for very little reason.