Is this season just objectively bad and I never realized?

[Joan the Vampire Slayer]

Could it be you were so focused on Spuffy that you didn't notice everything else going on around them in s7?

Honestly, no. I think it's more that as I've aged, I've come to realize that I have mad a lot of excuses for the bad parts of the series, because it's so good overall.

We're all fans of the show, but even when we love something so much, it doesn't mean it's flawless, and it's perfectly OK to critique it and not blindly support it 'just because'.

Oh, absolutely! Isn't that what this forum is all about?

It definitely lends to the argument that the series should've ended as intended, at s5. Don't get me wrong; s7 has some great elements, some great standalone episodes, and the arc itself (fighting the First evil) was an interesting idea, but unfortunately it wasn't executed properly. It fell flat on its face.

Absolutely agree. Even more so as I get older. And as much as I love all the Spuffy stuff in S6 and S7, even I can admit the show should have ended then.

S7 is bloated with unnecessary storylines, relationships, too many new characters, speeches, and an evil that twiddles its thumbs. It's very, very problematic, and would rank as one of the lowest in the entire series.

Right. It reminds me of Supernatural and TVD - always introducing new characters where I can't even keep track.

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 4:32 PM

But overall there is more to enjoy in S7, Buffy herself starts out better, Xander's pretty okay, Dawn improves greatly, uh, there's more Giles, Faith shows up eventually and the action set pieces are better than S6's (rather woeful) ones.

Agree about Dawn. It's cool to see her character develop and mature. And it's always great to see Faith for sure.

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 4:39 PM

Its bad but in a different way than Season 6. Season 6 had some decent ideas that were executed terribly. Plus the whole depression plot line and AR, well thats not what I watch for entertainment.

See, I know I'm in the minority but S6 is my favorite season because it's relatable. I love the idea of the "Big Bad" being life. The characters deal with real stuff - depression, addiction, toxic relationships - things I have personally dealt with my own life. But I totally agree it's a downer and not very entertaining in a traditional way.And of course I find Spuffy fascinating so I love all the screen time they get. Also has OMWF and Tabula Rasa, my fav ep.

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 4:40 PM

I think the most offensive thing is that the rape metaphor (clearly shown as such) of episode 15 is now the female empowerment moment of episode 22. You have a voice over of Buffy talking about giving a choice while literally showing a montage of girls (one looks 12) of not being given a choice ! Did no one stop and point out to Joss that contradiction ?

This is such a great point I never really thought of.

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 4:42 PM

Yeah, they really wanted binding of Sineya to be a rape metaphor, that they never answered the question, a metaphor for what?

We learn that the First Slayer's powers were forced on her, right? Without her consent? So that would be the metaphor for rape.

 

[Kendar]

I refer to this as "Watching on momentum". When you've been watching a show you really enjoy, it can take a while to realize you aren't actually enjoying it anymore.

 

[SavvyScoobie]

You compare S3 Buffy and going up against the Mayor. Taking advice from everyone, delegating tasks to people with the right skills, researching and coming up, despite some wobbles, with a plan that had a chance of working, to her behaviour in S7; taking advice only from Spike and coming up with a "plan" that literally has no way of succeeding. Unless the plan was "lure everyone into a trap, get them wiped out and unleash the Ubervamps." The difference between the competent S3 Buffy and the incompetent S7 Buffy is Spike and what you have is someone making bad decision after bad decision thanks to abuse.

100% but I also think it's because the writers wanted to punish Buffy. At this time (late 90s early 2000s), many of the few young female leads were led down a disappointing path to develop the male characters more.

A lot of writers punish their female characters and degrade them, especially using their romantic interests. It's disgusting and makes my skin crawl. We all say that Buffy is a strong female lead but do the writers know that? They think that 'strong' means staying with your abuser and going through depression when you just needed mental help. That's not strong, thats hiding your pain.

It feels like a punishment because why tf is Buffy all friendly friendly with the guy that tried to rape her? It could be a trauma response, but that's no excuse for the show to just gloss over that! Spike briefly apologized and that's it. You can't convince me they didn't hate this girl. Feels like a narrative trying to tell young women to just 'forgive or forget'. It's incredibly problematic.

I'm tired of the rape culture everywhere in this show. It's one of the major criticisms I have for it.

They put her through so much. I sometimes I pause the show to think like 'this a lot, maybe too much'.

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 11:00 PM

IIRC, Joss's version of feminism doesn't consider women's liberation to be a modern question that arises from increased leisure time for the working classes, but rather, the fighting of a sexist conspiracy haunting humanity since the earliest days of civilization.

When people say Buffy is a feminist show I just roll my eyes. It's just white feminism, and Buffy's abuser not being held responsible? Uhhh not feminist at all.

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 11:01 PM

We learn that the First Slayer's powers were forced on her, right? Without her consent? So that would be the metaphor for rape.

Buffy should've never touched on rape. The writers are atrocious when it comes to that.

Post automatically merged: Yesterday at 11:03 PM

With. One. Bathroom.

Who needs Hell, they're already living it. 😀

Storyteller would have ended with the Potentials breaking into the bathroom and beating Andrew to death.

I see people mention this all the time on tt.

Literally horrifying.